Descent of Angels and Units
March 29, 2011 by dignity
Darrell chats about if Astorath The Grim will give desent of angels to his unit or not.
BoW Justin
UPDATE: War is Declared on Darrell (bout time lol)
Will this make Darrell care about what people think... probably not!
Will this make him stop his eternal hunt for cheese... highly unlikely!
Will this entertain the rest of the team endlessly seeing him called out... hell yes lol!
Thanks to John over at WargamePainting.
BoW Warren
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silly cheese angels…
I would spend half an hour reading my rulebook to find a rule against it. Actually i think there might is…: I you have to handle this special charakter as if he has no deepstrike rule and you cant put them on the board toegether. 1st. If there is one special char in your unit, and he has a rule like : move through cover the rest of the unit not automatically gets it. 2nd. Units who cant deepstrike cant deeepstrike with units who can. 3rd. A unit can, because of close combat, get out of the 2″ distance that… Read more »
So wait. What you’re saying is that Astorath passes the DoA rule to the whole unit and so they all deep strike with 1D6 scatter. I find it a bit cheesy, since DoA only refers to models with JP since the only way to get that Special Rule is by having a JP. So Termies don’t get that rule. This can be very frustrating for opposing players.
If I’m mistaken, then good for my BA 😀
How about Dante and a Termies Unit? Do they deep strike without any scatter whatsoever?
I would say for the Termies just Roll a Scatter Die with no other D6. The direction shown ont he scatter die is which way the unit will be put 2″ that way from Dante so they are still in unit coherency.
Strange since the JP gives only the model who wears it the DoA rule. Anyways. If Astorath gives the unit DoA then Dante should also give the no scatter since it talks about Dante and the unit he is in.
For Dante it specifically states that only a unit deploying by deepstrike using jump packs does not scatter, it isn’t passed onto say a storm raven or land raider.
I think that you’re right Astorath would over rule it.
But lets say Asorath got 3″ away and the Termies got 7″ away, to keep the unit in coherency, within 2″, the Termies would be 2″ away from Astorath in the direction shown on the scatter dice.
Anybody else think this is how to interpret that?
when is grey knight week
Grey Knight What?
😉
BoW Andy
Was expecting to find something in the rules/FAQs stopping ICs with jump packs deep striking in with a unit of terminators and vice versa, but can not, which is just more GW idiocy if you ask me. How can a unit arrive together when some members are teleporting and some falling from the sky?
It’s just not clear due to the whole Stealth precedent, but I assume in a future FAQ they will stop you doing this. No hang on this is GW, who am I kidding?
“to yous guys 6 inches is a big deal, to me its nothing really.” Lol Darrell.
What are you implying.
Sorry but I’m 98% sure this is pure cheating 😛
The Decent of angels only works on things with jump packs, and therefore it is over ridden by the terminator deep strike. It is not a case of them staying with him, it is a case of him staying with them.
As in. the way a unit moves with the speed of the slowest model, a unit will deep strike with the accuracy of the worst member.
Sorry, Darryl, but I don’t agree. The main 40k rule book says that when an independent character joins a unit, the unit’s special rules are not conferred on the character and the character’s special rules are not conferred on the unit – unless the rule specifically says otherwise.
In the BA codex, characters that always have a jump pack (eg Astorath) always have DOA. Characters or units that may or may not have jump packs (eg veterans) don’t start with DOA but do get it if they take jump packs.
Totally aggree, I don’t see any Independant Character passing his special rules to the attached squad. Imagine Mordrak passing his Ghostly body guard Special Rule to a Paladin unit. LOL
Mordrak is not an IC. But I get your point 😉
Darrell is wrong and here’s why: Main Rule Book, Page 48: Special Rules When an independent character joins a unit, it might have different special rules from those of the unit. Unless specified in the rule itself (as in the ‘stubborn’ special rule), the unit’s special rules are not conferred upon the character, and the character’s special rules are not conferred upon the unit. In some cases though, the independent character or the unit may lose their special rules as a result of the character joining the unit. For example, if an independent character without the ‘infiltrate’ special rule joins… Read more »
To be honest the post from xeroen is exactly how I would have understood it… even from a fluff stand point Astorath would deep strike with a jump pack where as terms get teleported in.
Though for myself with Astorath as a chaplain i like to throw him in with Death Company or Perhaps sanguinary guard over terms anyway
Yep you’ve put it best, Darrell is wrong because of pg.48.
Good work! Destroy all cheese, the Sons of Sanguinius do not need it!
Looks like a certain BoW person has forgotten how to read the F.A.Q.s that gw puts out.
Is descent of angels teleporting or deep striking as there is a difference?
It is a rule that only applies to models that are deep striking via jump pack. Terminators don’t deep strike via jump pack, they teleport.
Deep strike via jump pack or teleport still end up using the same Deep Strike rule though – which is what Darrel’s trying to cheese here. 🙂
Darrel brother you are wrong as always…. well almost always……
As a Blood Angel player myself I’d have to say I’d slap anyone who tried this. 🙂
As others here have mentioned: the DoA rule doesn’t say it’s transferred to units joined by a character; it does say it applies to jump pack units only; and it should probably fall under the “moves at the speed of the slowest” rule too. I’d be playing it as the character scatters 2d6 if he wants to stay with the squad.
Sounds like Darrel’s cheese is over maturing!!
BGB Page 48
Q: If a unit with the Descent of Angels rule Deep Strikes
via a transport, teleport or means other than by jump pack,
can the Descent of Angels rule still be used? (p23)
A: No.
-Quoted from GW’s “Blood Angels v.1.1 Errata & FAQ’s
For once you’ve actually got it purely wrong.
This isn’t even bending rules, this is down-right breaking them. A truly illegal move.
In fact I’m actually shocked BOW let this go out.
Sometimes its almost as if Darrell likes to wind people up 😉
Interesting note…
If I remember correctly I’m 90% sure during Blood Angels Week we stated this wasn’t possible lol
Do you think he just gets bored lol 😉
lol yeah now warzan says I’m pretty sure it was Darrell who said special rules aren’t given to units when a character joins them! Darrell is trolling
Y’know what, that wouldnt surprise me at all. Especially after watching you two talk about the “balanced” profile of your *cough* Megalith *cough*
i would think that astorath would give the unit this as he is the slowest model in the unit and the rulebook says tht a model moves at its slowest members pace, if a model had slow and purposeful, he would effectively give the unit tht rule by forcing them to move at his pace. So the special rule is not lost
All Daryl is trying to do is get you fired up. There is no way that even the most obnoxious 40k player could argue this. Descent of angels applies to blood angel models with jump packs, not personal teleporters. Astorath and the terminators would have to start the battle on the board, or walk on from reserve. On a personal note, I hope all blood angel players have enough class and self respect to not try and pull this against anyone.
Gee, it is obvious Darrell is having fun and trying to jack everybody up…
I don’t deep strike much however in my BA codex it is clearly stated it passes on to units w/ jump packs…
However you can never be to sure remember the blood talons rule change 🙂 for dreads…
@dawnpatrolchapter What changed with the blood talons?
When codex first came out you could repeat attacks for each wound, However a FAQ was released stating you can only do it once instead of over and over again…
I found this out at a tourney after I built 2 dreads w/ blood talons (what you see is what you get)
standard…
Now there dressed out as libby’s pushing blood lance 🙂
What faq are you referring to? In the one on Games-Workshop website there is nothing that describes such a thing.
It was on a print out that stated what I said hey play it anyway you choose could care less but that was the ruling there OK- far be it for me to ruffle the feathers of 28 yr old virgins who still live in there moms basement and spends there mcdonalds pay check on GW plastic. Which is currently trading higher than gold… http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1240365a_FAQ_BloodAngels_2010.pdf http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1180159_Blood_Angels_Codex_and_FAQ_2007-08_5th_Edition.pdf It looked like one of these printed up, I would search deeper I know its there read it myself and took a hard hit while playing there. However I quit playing tourneys due to… Read more »
eric is right. There is nothing in the blood angels faq that limits the number of attacks a furioso can possibly make with blood talons.
it says in the FAQ it cant
Exactly thank you for making my point…
vvv4455 nailed it- however it did read that way and I wasnt alone in this understanding of text. I was new at the time to 40k. So it was an honest mistake. If you go back to blood angel week here on BoW. there is a video that asks the samething…
End of the Day I freaking love this Beasts of War site, However can do without some of my fellow wargamers 🙂
Does Darrell actually read the rules?
I know a lot of young kids who just like to make it up as they go along.
Darrell is a Wargaming god,
…and makes the rest of you look like armless children at a golf tournament 🙂
I just went to Games Workshop Blood Angels FAQ, and didn’t see anything referring to the blood talons. So what FAQ are you guys talking about?
Must have been an FAQ for the older PDF/White Dwarf codex. The latest BA book is pretty specific that the Talons do keep generating attacks.