Why do all our wargames rules have to cost the bomb?

[hughsfamily 2923xp 5]

I actually think most wargames rule books are cheap when you consider how much time and effort has gone into producing the games. A few weeks ago Warren was asking about raising the profile/income of the rules writers. The question supposes that the expense is all tied up in a nice glossy hardback book with “non rule stuff” to bulk it out, but all that background and information is often very helpful and in the case of rules like By Fire and Sword can spark off a lot of interesting research. In the case of some rules such as Burrows and Badgers the illustrations and fun snippets help to set the tone of the game. I do like a quick reference sheet included fr general use at the table top.

Out of interest your £6.00 black and white stapled together rule book from 1994 would cost you £11.00 today so I think we are not doing too badly on value for money.

[jamescutts 6924xp 1]

Very good point on the value front @hughsfamily, the quality of what you can get for that £11.00 say an osprey blue book is significantly higher than those stapled together bits of paper.

[admiralandy 1647xp 1]

Being from that era of the A5 B&W rulebooks when I first got into the hobby, I very much view the Osprey series as the spiritual successfor.

Smallish compared to A4 hardbacks, and generally self containened and whilst the rules can be a bit patchy, there are some real gems in there, and the quality is fantastic for a bang for the buck gems. Just be sure to check out youtube and reviews first.

[tankkommanderParticipant 6421xp 1]

I think the OP should listen to The Oddcast from T00 Fat Lardies. https://toofatlardies.libsyn.com/toofatlardies-oddcast-episode-eight starting at the 24 minute mark. There is an interesting discussion on the costs of producing rules.

[limburger 21704xp 1]

I kind of doubt that rulebooks are the most expensive part of this hobby.

The amount of money spend on the average army is probably much higher.

And even if you ignore that … the cost of getting into this hobby with minimal effort is pretty low compared to other hobbies (like videogames or computers … ) where you’re not even ready to begin with 60 Euro in your pocket.

[darkvoivod 7112xp 2]

What’s expensive is very subjective to me. I noticed I really have an ‘Edition’-fatigue.
Infinity, for instance, is, in my eyes, a very boutique range. The models are gorgeous, but when I play, I want everything to look cool. So I buy acrylic templates, instead of using card print outs and, while Corvus Belli offers the rules for free on their website, I haven’t played it since 4th edition came out. I’ve heard great things about it, but I’ve already spend about 150 euro on both 2nd and 3rd edition and now, If I give them money, I’d rather expand my armies. I’m sure I’ll get the new book at some point, but I just don’t like playing with some ugly printed stack of paper next to all that shiney stuff.

On the other hand I love buying books for new systems. Some are well priced (Gaslands, Last Days, Bushido) and I enjoy the art and fluff, but it’s all new. Not something I’ve been reading on repeat basicly for several editions. In fact I think it’s a darn shame the Bushido book is all rules and no fluff and I really hope their expansion tells me more about the setting and I’d happily pay good money for that. I spend a good ammount on a deluxe edition of rangers of shadowdeep and love flipping though it.

So that’s what makes it worth the price for me, or not. I think it’s mostly about a persons percieved worth of the product and that’ll vary from person to person.

[casanovafunkensteinParticipant 411xp 0]

I kind of doubt that rulebooks are the most expensive part of this hobby.

The amount of money spend on the average army is probably much higher.

And even if you ignore that … the cost of getting into this hobby with minimal effort is pretty low compared to other hobbies (like videogames or computers … ) where you’re not even ready to begin with 60 Euro in your pocket.

 

I agree. There’s a reason why the customer base for Tabletop RPGs is about the same size as wargaming, but the profitability is dramatically lower. It comes down to the more tangible aspects: the miniatures and terrain and other supplies that RPG players tend to fill in with their imagination much more readily.

 

The buy-in for this sort of thing really depends a lot on how skilled you are at scratch building and how much effort you’re willing to put in on developing those skills, as well as whether you’re prepared to go indie.

[limburger 21704xp 1]

yep … the one disadvantage to this hobby (from a commercial point of view) : if you’ve got the rules then you’re set for life …

At least RPG’s get to sell you more campaigns & adventures & splat books, but it is very rare for any wargame to have extra content for sale (that doesn’t feel like it was left out of the core book on purpose).

 

[tankkommanderParticipant 6421xp 1]

Stargrave has an expansion planned already.

GW churn out books all the time.

Chain of Command has multiple campaign books.

Team Yankee and Flames of War churn out army books on a regular basis.

[ninjillyParticipant 11673xp 3]

The idea of buy rules once and you never need them again is the same reason RPGs suffer from edition cycling as well. The number of people who buy the extra books that come out is minuscule by comparison to those who buy the core rules. It’s the same reason companies produce more books for players than for GMs – there will always be far more players (who love to have new things to do/classes to play) than there are GMs.

Thanks for including that link @tankkommander That was a very interesting discussion to listen to.

[bobcockayne 20723xp 0]

Its funny this topic coming up, talking to friend about the old pony wars rules, in the little booklet and all the little rule set that appeared in past. Often at shows you would pick up a set for about a £5, (which may be relative in cost rule sets now) for odd periods, genres that may have raised a little bit of interest , but without wanting to have a massive new investment.

One of our groups members didnt buty figure much , but did buy these types of rules to try on on normal gaming night with whatever figures/models fitted.

[tankkommanderParticipant 6421xp 0]

It’s the same reason companies produce more books for players than for GMs – there will always be far more players (who love to have new things to do/classes to play) than there are GMs.

Which is why WoTC put player resources (new character races and classes) info inside of adventure books. The GM buys the books for the adventure and the players buy is for the class/race. I am not a fan of this.

Of course they then also re-print it all (with minor tweeks) in books like Tashas Guide to Everything. So you have the joy of buying it all twice 🙂

 

 

[limburger 21704xp 0]

@tankkommander cynics might wonder why the planned rules in Stargrave aren’t in the core set … 😉

The classic wargame rules were not designed to drain your wallet like videogames do these days.

And while Battlefront may churn out army books on a regular basis … they practically give away the core rules for ‘free’ in their starter sets.

// —
Are the rules really that expensive ?
If I look at the minimal costs I would have to pay to get started then it’s not too bad even for the big boys :

GW :
– core rules = free download
– 1 codex = +/- 20 pound (OTT Store)
done
Yes, you can buy the 50 Euro flashy rules, but you don’t need them.

Battlefront – Flames of War :
– A5 core rules = 15 pounds (OTT Store)
– army list = +/- 13 pounds (OTT Store) or +/- 6 pounds (faction unit cards)
Technically you could be playing for 21 pounds per player (or less if you share the core rules)

Both have starter sets for their primary factions that include the rules and essential unit cards of your chosen faction.
Fluff is minimal …

I think AoS / 40k full rule books are the only ones that actually cross the magical 30 pound barrier.
IT’s not impossible to start cheaper even with the ‘bigger’ brands, but you do have to know where to look as they don’t advertise those options as easily.

As such it only gets ‘expensive’ if you get hit by the ‘need to collect them all’ … and if you avoid buying the ‘official’ minis there is more money to be saved.

The real money is in your army … and only if you buy the official models at release.

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