Interesting News From Monolith

[onlyonepinman 18062xp 0]

I suspect if you don’t already own the game this will have negligible impact on cost compared to what you would pay as it stands now.  But buying the core rules is a one time thing, after that the cost per game should, in theory, drop which is I think what they’re aiming at.

While it may be true that there’s some examples of disasters with universal rules sets, the fact that D&D, Savage Worlds, Pathfinder and to an extent Modiphius’ 2D20 system are so successful despite being setting agnostic speaks for itself.   Success or failure for Monolith will depend on which settings they opt for.  However I trust that they know what they’re about, they have been successful enough thus far on Kickstarter at least and I don’t see any specific reason why that would change

[ced1106Participant 6224xp 0]

I’m fine with it, but I’ve played so many “custom dice” games (eg. HeroQuest, Descent) that I don’t find the game engine all that interesting.

“Second Life is based on the observation that over the last few years, players have been accumulating more and more miniatures, which are seeing less time on the table. As a result, they tend to remain in their boxes, gathering dust, rather than gracing the game boards. In response, Monolith will offer, for excellent price points, VERSUS MODE THS kits * consisting of character tiles, equipment cards, as well as game maps and associated Scenarios. At first, these Kits will concern our proprietary worlds (Mythic Battle Pantheon, Mythical Battle Ragnarök, Claustrophobia), but very soon, they will be accompanied by many other universes, whose licenses are already being discussed and negotiated with other major market publishers. Some of these miniatures and settings from other popular games may already be on your shelf.”

Sounds good, although I’m still waiting for a Song of Blade and Heroes card format, where each ability is printed on its own separate card with its point value. I already found a way to do this… : https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1989522/diy-point-value-and-trait-reference-cards-or-why-y

[zoidpinhead 12492xp 0]

I’m very glad that they have addressed an area of concern for those of us who are serial Kickstarter supporters.  Second Life for all of my minis across a range of game engines, and a way to use the game I’ve learned across a range of my minis feels like a win-win for me.  So I have to fork out again to buy the new core rule boxes.  I’d still rather that than have the stuff sitting in boxes and not getting used much.

[limburger 21708xp 0]

The one thing I’ve always noticed is that whenever production costs could be lower that never was reflected in the price us consumers had to pay.

It is an interesting development that’s for sure.

I do wonder how they’ll manage the inevitable rules updates as campaign modules get released.

One of the problems with D&D and its various campaign settings was that only the popular ones would get updates after a new iteration of the core rules. I think it was one of the reasons they reduced the amount of official campaigns that were maintained to a few.

@onlyonepinman I’d argue that Pathfinder/D&D/2D20 aren’t setting agnostic.
They all require a specific style of game to function at peak performance. Monolyth has managed to made very good choices in picking the type of setting that supports the heroic/tv-movie fiction format their system supports. I kind of doubt it would work for a setting where the sudden appearance of ‘extra’ enemies wouldn’t fit the theme.
D&D has serious problems running the kind of gritty fiction in Warhammer and Call of Cthulluh, which is why D20 Modern doesn’t quite work unless you target A-team style action.

[onlyonepinman 18062xp 0]

D20, and it’s successors (D&D and Pathfinder)needs a specific type of game, not a specific setting. I can name several examples of variants of d20 that are not fantasy based and all of them work.  As a game it is geared towards high action games and doesn’t really do very well when you slow it down to more investigative types if game like call of Cthulu.  However there is absolutely no reason at all why you can’t use the d20 mechanic to run a game in a much darker setting like Warhammer or Call of Cthulu, you could even argue that it has already been done with the likes of Ravenloft and Darksun.  A games ambience doesn’t come from it’s rules mechanic.

This principle can be applied to almost any rules mechanic- it’s not going to work for every type of game and Monolith’s engine is no different.  It’s definitely not going to work for an investigation type game, but it will absolutely work for high action swashbuckling adventure game.

I am not going to comment on the specifics costs and pricing. Monolith are touting it as a way to make it cheaper for players to buy into multiple settings and I am prepared to take them at their word until we actually see otherwise.  If it doesn’t actually make it any easier or cheaper, if a saving  is not passed on to the consumer, then it will be a failed endeavor.  If this doesn’t lead to an increase in sales then they are ploughing money into something that isn’t going to pay for itself.  I suspect Monolith might not pass 100% of any savings on to their customers but we won’t ever know the details of that.  But I suspect they will pass some on.  I think you will start to see options on their kickstarters of miniatures only deals where you just get miniatures and stat cards, which are cheaper than buying the whole package.

[slayerofworldsParticipant 3449xp 1]

It just seems like they are switching from a board game model into the Tabletop Wargame model.

You buy your core rulebooks/boxset, and then you pick up your individual model sets as you like (with rules for those models/armies being part of the model box or free online).

The only difference being the core rulebook/boxset is “generic”.   That’s all.   I don’t see what the big shocking reveal is.  I mean this is how tabletop wargames have basically been done since forever.

[onlyonepinman 18062xp 0]

It’s not exclusively how tabletop wargames have been done, while it’s certainly common among historical games, less so in fantasy/sci fi.  I don’t think anyone is saying it’s “shocking” though.  Interesting yes , because it’s a boardgame rather which don’t typically work this way, but certainly not shocking

[limburger 21708xp 0]

@slayerofworlds marketing materials tend to use ‘shocking’ a lot … so I kind of ignore it.
As was mentioned in this thread the idea is not exactly ‘new’.

The only ‘new’ thing is that they’re bringing it down to the consumer level in the boardgame market, because (IMHO) this is how companies manage to support a large catalog of games with minimal effort. It is a very standard idea in software development as well …

@onlyonepinman I’d argue that (good) game mechanics support a theme in such a way that it really adds to the experience. I considered Ravenloft to be a good idea that never quite worked (for me) due to the way D&D is designed.

[onlyonepinman 18062xp 0]

Stories have themes in many levels, and in game terms some are supported by the rules of a game, others by the setting’s lore and background.  Rules will help you tell certain types of story, but they won’t necessarily dictate the genre or the setting in which you tell them.  I am reasonably certain you could use most RPG rules systems to tell a story in just about any setting you want, provided the story focuses on activities that the rules are designed to facilitate.  I think this applies to most rules systems not just RPGs

Also, the new 5E Ravenloft works just fine for d&d.  If you like that sort of thing

[horus500 11505xp 2]

If there is anything I think a few of these companies should start realising is that there is no need to constantly re-invent the wheel.

If I were Monolith I’d do 2 things;

1) I’d look at redoing the Conan game, ironing out issues, re-doing rules based on community feedback etc. It’s a great game with a great IP. It’s a few years since the KS and it may be time to consider adding more scenarios, doing another print run (ala Mythic Pantheon) or even making it available to Bricks and Mortar FLGS, to bring in new players.

2) Partner up with an existing skirmish system eg. like SAGA, and sell the components and a licenced army list for the Conan IP (obviously there would be legal\licencing issues to deal with first but think of the potential!). They could have a ‘SAGA of Conan’ source book showing Monolith miniatures, fighting skirmishes in the Conan IP. No need to create a whole new rule system, and a win-win for Studio Tomohawk and Monolith.

What no one wants or needs right now are more skirmish rule sets in the historical, sci-fi or fantasy settings. What we want is bang for buck with the miniatures we already have. If I can use the same miniatures for a boardgame, RPG, several exisiting skirmish and larger unit scale combat games, then the miniatures and the investment of my time and money are worth it. What I don’t need, is more rules sets.

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