Hobby Weekender 17/08/18

[oriskany 60771xp 2]

Good evening, all ~

Okay, I’m e-mail my group this evening and informing them that I’ll probably taking a weekend off from running Darkstar.  Also, the first appreciable slice of media for the Boot Camp ramp-up is done … so I may have some time this weekend to actually hobby a little!  Furthermore, some models have arrived, the first ones I have bought since last December when I had to build armies for the Vietnam War / Tet Offensive series.

What can I say, I like a small lead mountain.

Okay, to questions …

Cloning Technology
Okay, that’s a tricky one. Lemme take a stab at it.

When it comes to judging whether a technology is “good” or “bad” for the world, it bears remembering to take a step back and a step forward … to keep in mind the enabling technology that allowed the tech in question, and what the next step in that tech will be.

So cloning is basically born out of the manipulation of genes. So far, I feel it is incontrovertible that this has been a good thing. The genetic creation of short-stalk wheat has reduced the level of world hunger by how much of a percentage? New vaccines, medicines, disease-resistant crops for food production, the list is endless.

Cloning starts (from what little I know about it) with the creation of new cultures, organs, tissues, etc. for medical purposes. Again, this starts out really great, leaving aside the debate over stem-cells (okay, we’re close to violating one of the rules here on politics and religion). When organs and tissues cannot be repaired or healed due to disease (especially cancer), degenerative disorders (like Alzheimers), or injury, cloning a new liver, tissue for a lung, or other organ might really be a revolutionary step in the improvement of the quality of life.

But then we start to run into the hazards. Genetic manipulation can also lead to “designer” babies. It’s a slippery slope. Parents can go to a clinic and make sure their child won’t be born with all kinds of heartbreaking ailments … but what’s to stop them from asking for blue eyes instead of brown? A heightening intelligence? Physical stature? As we see in some better fiction like Gataca, within a few generations we soon wind up with a new nobility, a new genetic elite that you literally have to be born into. Your lot in life is decided in a lab before you’re born. Ironically, it starts to sound very medieval.

Full-blown cloning of entire humans is a ways off, so much that it’s tough to predict whether it would be a good or bad thing. What I mean is, how cloning would effect society at large is honestly a little dependent on how the cloning would actually be carried off.

Say @mage wants a clone of himself so he can paint more models. Fair enough. How is this done? He gives a drop of blood and maybe a few stem cells out of his spinal column or some such and the lab starts growing a clone. Does it take nine months to gestate? Is it born as a child? It has to grow up right? This takes 20 years. Say “Mage2” has a different experience growing up on the clone farm, he grows up hating gaming and martial arts, and instead becomes a concert pianist? Is Mage2 really a clone at that point?

Would clones be produced much faster? Say (to be a little more fanciful) that a Star Trek transporter has a setting that allows copy-paste functionality instead of cut-and paste. Mage steps into the transporter aboard the starship USS Oriskany and instead of simply eliminating his molecules on one place and reforming them in another, the transporter produces a whole new copy of him next to the original. Basically this is how transporter work in that *ahem* “universe” anyway, but say Chief Engineer @biggabum hits the “transport” button twice too fast and two fully developed, fully-aged Mages show up side by side?

Which is the real one? Does Mage2 count as a sentient being? Does he have free will? What happens when Mage1 tries to get Mage2 to paint his extra miniatures (the reason Mage2 was created) and Mage2 doesn’t want to?

All the way back to the wheel and fire, whether technology is a “good” or “bad” influence of course depends on how it’s applied. This is the obvious part. I would just add that every tech ever invented was in fact the “next step” for an earlier tech and a “baseline” for a following tech. What cloning tech would grow out of, and what it would develop into, is just as important (and impossible to black-and-white characterize) as how such technology would be used to harm or benefit mankind as a whole.

Do you think we are the remains of a once more advanced society?
While its an interesting idea from a fiction standpoint (I love the Hyborean Age from the original Robert E Howard Conan novels), honestly I do not think that the human race arose out of the ashes of some “Atlantean” or “Lemurean” culture. The historical and archaeological evidence just isn’t there. I mean, not to put on the “Historical Editor” hat here, but … no.

That said, there are more esoteric arguments that can be made that “outflank” historical fact and approach this question from the side, so to speak. After all, at least here in the US and most or Europe, are we not somewhat arisen from the Roman Republic / Roman Empire?

The Roman Empire did suffer calamity, it did fall, and we have totally had to rebuild from the ashes. Expand that to the Classical World and you have all kinds of further arguments along this line. Greek scientists knew the world was round in the third century BCE, we sure as shit didn’t need Columbus or Magellan telling is that 1750-1850 hundred years later. The lost libraries of Alexandria, the loss of Athenian city-state democracy (that had to be rebuilt) the loss of the Roman republic model (that had to be rebuilt) the loss of the Marian model professional army (that had to be rebuilt) …

I would certainly not say that the Classical Greco-Roman world was more advanced than we are now (never forget how happily these cultures embraced slavery and misogyny). But between the fifth and fifteenth centuries … a huge slice of recorded history … at least in Europe and the West … yeah. We really were further behind than we had been. Of course the Renaissance and the Age of Reason got us caught up and we haven’t looked back since.

Also, this certainly didn’t happen on a global scale. While Europe wallowed the Dark and Middle Ages, cultures in the Middle East and India were far ahead of us in mathematics, science, literature, you name. And in the East you have things like Japanese isolationism and the successive rises and falls of China that kept seeing their culture “rise from more advanced cultures that had fallen to ruin in the past.”

So this kind of this does happen. Just not on a global scale, and not for humanity as a whole, all at once. As with just about anything historical, the trust is always a little more complicated. 😀

A game you have wanted to get into but have not yet done so?
X-Wing. I have a few of the models, and the starter set, and two of my all-time favourite Star Wars craft … the B-Wing heavy assault starfighter. I also have a starter set my friend @bothi gave me when he visited Florida from Germany, I even have this copy in German! (I love my “TIE Jaegers”) So I have it, some of the planes, and would love to just mass-buy a shitload of all the good fighters (X-Wings, Y-Wings, A-Wings, B-Wings, TIE Fightes, TIE Bombers, TIE Interceptors … anything after that and you’re getting into EU silliness) … I just haven’t gotten around to it yet.

Well, that’s probably enough for now. 😀

[oriskany 60771xp 1]

@evilstu – to answer your question from last weeks thread – I have re-checked and do not have a PM from you. 🙁

[evilstu 15298xp 1]

OK @oriskany just tried messaging again – seems to have worked this time 🙂

Slow progress for me today – think coffee might assist… have fished out my Reaper Xmas minis and primed (I have a knight, cleric, bard, druid and a couple of arcane casters so I think I’m just short a ranger?…) and a leader for my French Napoleonics. Also been painting some counters for Sharp Practice and printing a bit more scenery for Kill Team. Photos and a more meaningful update later…

[elessar2590 18207xp 3]

Hey guys Obligatory Music. Was doing some work in the shed today and had the radio on so enjoy come “Classic Aussie Rock”

Questions: 1. For me if you want to do it then you go ahead and do it. Personally I wouldn’t and I would consider the clone as fully human so no organ harvesting/spare parts.

(2) Nope.

(3)  I would really really really like to wargame in the Meiji Restoration Period of Japan (Boshin War 1860’s) unfortunately there is one company that sells minis for the period and while they look awesome it’s not a finished collection.

I started on some more Mahdist War (Sudan 1880’s) minis Yesterday. Nine Mahdists on Camels and a British Hospital Section with a Surgeon and some stretchers, the stretchers are mostly for objectives, escort the stretchers, guard the stretchers, recover the wounded.

Then I went out into the aforementioned shed and stripped/scraped the paint from this old Dog Sculpture my Grandparents have had for years. Next step is to fix it’s legs then on to the painting.

Little Koota was pretty convinced since he tried to intimidate/run from/play with the statue.

[elessar2590 18207xp 2]

@biggabum nice you’re already finished before most of us have started 🙂

@sundancer looking good. I love the “organisation”. Nice change from the chaos of my Painting table 🙂

[woldenspoonsParticipant 3557xp 2]

I’m struggling to answer question one and two while avoiding getting into politics or religion.

I’m not sure I’ve ever come across media where clones ended up a good thing. I’ve also read some Peter Hamilton and enjoy his works. I’m currently reading Ack Ack Macaque and this is highly recommended by me. So that’s personality cloning. Physical cloning would only lead to ‘improvements’ being made and that is a long and dangerous slippery slope leading to the originals being hunted to extinction by a superior species. Much like homo sapiens replaced our predecessors.

For question two I didn’t think so until I considered Stonehenge, the pyramids and a certain organisation’s condemnation of scientists not even that long ago. It still annoys me that it’s 2018 and we don’t live in space. Man landed on the moon how long ago? If we find evidence of previous more advanced civilisations I feel it would be on the dark side of the moon or one of the other planets /moons we haven’t looked at properly yet.

Question 3. Sadly my local area struggles to support multiple systems. I can find a game of 40k fairly easily but anything else.is a struggle. I already play 40k, Age of Sigmar, Shadespire, Infinity, Malifaux, warmachine and dropfleet/dropzone commander so I’m hard pushed to find gaps. However as I’ve previously mentioned I am a DC Comics fan who also enjoys the TV shows like Flash and Gotham. @biggabum makes it even harder to ignore The Batman game. Beautiful figures, flavoursome looking game mechanics and lots of my favourite characters. As I said I don’t play it as I’d never actually get to. Oh @biggabum your work on Harley is stunning. What is your flesh recipe?

[biggabum 4565xp 1]

@mage The Mother in Law is no laughing matter as it is, two of them makes me shudder just thinking about it… you know the kind of shudder i’m on about, not the nice kind you get when its a bit colder when you go outside more the shudder you get when someone rubs two pieces of polystyrene together. Actually what is the collective term for Mother in Laws?…. A Coven?

@evilstu Thats true but it still comes as a bit of an eye opener when Matty points ot that some of these tunes are only five or six years away from being half a century old 😀

More replies in a bit got to pick the daughter up from work.

[biggabum 4565xp 1]

Ok i’m back…. but you already know that coz i’m writing this 😀

Where was I? Oh yeah.

@oriskany Yup thats me, always hitting the transport button twice 😀 Excellent answers by the way.

@elessar2590 Love the dog statue… although didn’t have my specs on it when I first looked and thought it was a real dog 😀

Nice start to the Sudan Miniatures.

Thanks. It was quick, but a lot easier than I thought it was going to be.

@woldenspoons Thank you Sir. Actually its a new way to me of doing flesh, something Matty suggested to me (not sure if he’s picked it up from somewhere else.

Mix some Army Painter Soft Shade in with Vomit Brown to make a base colour,  slightly more Soft Shade for male skin because womens features tend to be softer. The mix is quite fluid so it may take a couple of coats. Shade the eye sockets with Strong tone and then when dry add the white for the eyes and a small dot of black. Next neaten around the eyes with Vallejo Flat Earth. Then its highlighting first with Vomit brown and then Elf Flesh before adding the lips and then tidying them up with vomit brown and Elf flesh where it was needed . With Harley I did a final Highlight by mixing a tiny drop of Bleached Bone to White to get the Whiteface.

 

[evilstu 15298xp 2]

Progress shots from today – not as much done as I would have liked but moving in the right direction…

Firstly, progress on my historicals. just doing basics to get them on the tabletop quickly so outside chance I could get them to ‘varnishing’ stage this week.

And tokens for Sharp Practice painted. Still need to touch up a little and paint the reverse side in the applicable primary colour but that shouldn’t take too long.

And messing around a little more printing some extra ruin pieces for Kill Team.

Going to grab an early night so proper replies etc in the morning 🙂

[oriskany 60771xp 2]

Some proper replies –

Thanks again for hosting @mage .  😀  Hope you feel batter soon!  Gotta be careful with Chinese food! 😮

Great cars and tank, @evilstu – so those are models you’re going to “apocalypse-up” for Gaslands?   And I really like those Sharpe Practice / Napoleonics.  I’ve said it 100 times before, so let’s go for 101 – I have huge respect for anyone who tries Napoleonic in that scale.  I did American Revolution in just 20mm, 400 figures, and it took three months and that’s with my girlfriend drafted into doing 90% of the basing … and still I wanted to hang myself by the end.   Technically, they still  aren’t done (never put a good wash on all of them).

So yeah, mad respect.

Epic restoration of the metal vest, @sundancer – I wish I had kept more of my stuff from those years, just for nostalgia.  ANd i like those rebel troopers so far.

Great start on the Harley Quinn figure, @biggabum – so when does the obligatory Poison Ivy figure come out?  You know those two come as a  …*ahem* …  “pair” right?  😉

@elessar2590 – Working on more colonial Africa pieces?  North / East Africa (Egypt/Sudan/British Somalia), late 1800s?

 

[sundancer 42979xp 1]

@elessar2590 – without organisation my table would collapse 😉

@oriskany – I just never went past being 20’ish years old…. 😉 Don’t see the need for it XD

Now of to more painting…. there’s a general-princes waiting…

[biggabum 4565xp 1]

Errm anybody else keep getting logged out of BoW? its a bit of a pain when your trying to reply to stuff and get logged out and lose your reply.

@evilstu Most excellent work on the Napoleonics. Really nice job on the markers, is the numbering all freehand?

@oriskany No I did not know that…. I shall have to buy Poison Ivy now (not that I needed much of an excuse 😀 )

[biggabum 4565xp 2]

Batman looked down into the gloomy Gotham streets, still glistening from the now subsided rain. His cloak billowed, the folds making a shallow whumping sound, as they fluttered in the sudden bitter gust of Gotham wind. In the distance he could hear the usual night time sounds of the City, the traffic, a dog barking and the occasional Police Siren: A sound that would have, on any other night, signalled it was time for him to go to work. On any other night but this.
Somewhere below lurked the Joker and his Crew.
“Barbara is in position.” Nightwing approached from the far side of the rooftop. “She’s roped in pair of Gotham’s finest too.”
“Good, we may need them.” Batman stared at the hulking shadow of what he believed to be one of the Joker’s so called Titan Clowns. Ten feet of fearless bad tempered muscle. “They’re here.” Batman said flatly.
The Joker appeared first, moving out of the shadows and running into the cover of a pile of crates. Batman was in no doubt that he wanted to get a look at the contraband, Batman’s bait, spread out in the streets below. Joker scanned the rooftops first before signalling the rest of his Crew to move forward and grab whet they could.
Batman and Nightwing moved forward to the edge of the building, it was time to make their presence known. As they moved a shot rang out and shards of concrete flew into the air as the bullet went wide. If Joker hadn’t realised they were there before he certainly did now
Below Batgirl had run into the middle of the street, drawing the clown known as Whiteface out from the rock he was hiding under. His gun didn’t have enough range to worry her but she knew her own supporting Arkham Guard didn’t have the same problem as he opened fire and dropped Whiteface in a hail of good old Gotham lead.
Harley Quinn moved into the middle of the street, not a care for her own safety and fired a slug up at the two black clad heroes on the roof. If not for Nightwing’s reflexes he could have very well been the first casualty for the forces of order. He turned to Batman, nodded, and then used his Batclaw to make the street and into combat with Harley. Batman frowned at the young Hero’s hot headedness as the hulking form of a Titan Clown rounded the corner, swinging wildly, but failing to hit the youngster.
Batman hurled a pair of batarangs at one of the Jokers clowns foolish enough to stick his head out from behind the crates, knocking the Nail Gun armed goon clean out. Nightwing had come to his senses and extracted himself from the combat with the titan clown, as Harley Quinn retreated back to the relative safety of some barrels. The Titan clown was knocked out by a fusillade of gunfire from the Arkham Guard that would have killed any normal man. Batman saw his chance and leapt down from the building and finished the titan clown off.
The Jokers arrival from the sewers was completely unexpected, as was the shot that took Batman off his feet and into darkness.

There was noise, muffled at first but gradually became clearer as Batman regained his senses. Nightwing and Batgirl stood between him and what remained of the Jokers crew. He grabbed a nearby barrel and hauled himself to his feet, trying in vain to ignore the gaping wound in his side. A punch from Batgirl spun the Joker around to face him, summoning every last bit of strength he had, Batman concentrated it into his punch, catching Joker square on the chin and sending him unconscious to the floor.
There was a momentary look of horror on Harley Quinn’s face as she took stock of the situation. Realising that her “Puddin” was down, she gestured to the rest of the crew who vanished back into the shadows from whence they came. As she disappeared she looked over shoulder one last time and watched as Agent O Connell slapped the cuffs on the Joker.
“She’ll be back for him.” Batman muttered.

[woldenspoonsParticipant 3557xp 3]

Not many pictures taken today of my big game, but I am once again champion of the ERF. Death Guard vs Tyranids.

Mortarion was annoyed following his defeat at the hands of the Ultramarines. Brooding in silence he sent his underling Lord Karnum the Festering and his forces to collect samples from the approaching hive fleet. Hive Fleet Kraken.

He consulted with the sorcerers who digging through entrails and worse predicted the path of a splinter fleet.

The main forces landed and set about hunting the Xenos but quickly realised their folly. The Tyranids were hunting them.

As fast as lightning the giant lifeforms descended on the Death Guard cutting a fearsome toll. Only through the rapid deployment and intervention of the first company terminators was the tide turned and the Tyranids defeated. Lord Karnus had no time to celebrate his victory as system warnings were flooding through his damaged systems. Someone had arrived to chase them down and finish the job, but who was it?

[woldenspoonsParticipant 3557xp 1]

@biggabum I think we put our reports on together. Yours is tons better and not because I’m currently watching The Dark Knight.

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