Could Heroquest be finally coming back again?

[odinsgrandsonParticipant 4288xp 0]

Looking at this a little closer, it seems like this is really going to happen.

[balginstondraegParticipant 1151xp 1]

If you specifically want something with very similar rules and  a very similar feel to Warhammer Quest then I’d heartily recommend Nova Aetas and Darklight: Memento Mori. Darklight moreso than Nova Aetas. Nova Aetas has the feel but Darklight has similar rules as well as the feel (right down to putting the miniatures for slain monsters on your character sheet as trophies).

Darklight is a sort of Dark Souls style post apocalyptic fantasy where souls are a currency (like Dark Souls) but after every quest death comes for the heroes and they have to give him a soul. If the only soul they have is their own he takes it and they die. Fortunately he’s willing to take the souls of slain monsters allowing the heroes to live which is why souls are such a valuable commodity in this world.

Nova Aetas, on the other hand is a fantasy alternate Italian renaissance. So your heroes are playing a part in the power struggle between the Pope and the Italian Nobles with the endangered species of myth (fawns, satyrs, centaurs etc) as a third faction. You might want to hold off on Nova Aetas ‘though. it’s a lovely game but it’s getting overhauled for a second edition with improved rules, vastly improved miniature sculpts, and a kickstarter allegedly coming some time in the next month.

[limburger 21775xp 0]

After the CoG Radio show I must say that I am convinced that there could be a space for (classic) Heroquest or something similar.
The simplicity of the design which results in an almost instant recognition of all stereotypes for most folk who aren’t into the lore of a game is key to this.
You need to be a fan of Age of Sigmar to even begin to understand what the characters in Silver Tower are supposed to be.

I suspect the reboot is aimed at grown-ups who want to recapture part of their childhood without having to search fleabay for a playable version at a reasonable price.

There are two major hurdle for any new game aiming to capture the same audience as the original :
– videogames are cheaper and offer more immediate instant fun
– advertising and timing

I’m tempted to say that Zombicide is as close to the accesibility of Heroquest as there currently is.
However the theme isn’t as kid-friendly …

[ced1106Participant 6224xp 2]

One of the owners is a lawyer and, of course, they have experience with licensing boardgame IP’s. In fact, if you follow the BGG and Dakka threads, they’ve filed trademarks (?) or whatever IP protection on various other classic games. Both MB and GW have been licensing properties. With GW, though, FFG was not allowed to include miniatures in their games (they used sculpts like busts), although we don’t know if HQ will use GW miniatures or their own.

While the hobby gamer market has plenty of dungeon crawlers, it’s the nostalgia value of the game that drives demand, as well as its simplicity for new gamers. MB did release Dragon Quest (?) and other boardgames for younger players, but none have the same reputation. HeroQuest is such a powerful brand name, that it drew over 3/4 million dollars from a foreign company that had no connection to the original game. While there are better dungeoncrawlers out there (although all but Gloomhaven have the “throw dice and roll for hits vs shields” mechanic), none approach the nostalgia of HeroQuest. HeroQuest Legacies may end up not being the hobbyist’s dungeoncrawler, but I don’t think that’s its primary target audience.

[limburger 21775xp 1]

I’d argue that companies like MB are not into boardgames …
They sell toys disguised as boardgames, which is kind of why outsiders like Klaus Treuber managed to reboot the golden era of boardgaming.

It might also explain why we don’t have a ‘simple’ dungeon crawlwer like Heroquest, because the ones that make them are too obsessed with making them hard/complex that they forget the entry level stuff.

[crimsonsunParticipant 238xp 0]

Id suggest Sword and Sorcery or Shadows of Brimstone as some of the non Narrative focused crawlers that tick the most boxes from someone who has come from a heroquest background (I had Kellers Keeps, Return of the Witch King, Ogre Horde, and Wizard of Morcar) originally. I like Super Dungeon Explore but it doesn’t scratch the same itch, nor does Gloomhaven, I felt Dungeon Saga fell flat and its advanced rules positiively sucked so I wouldn’t recommend that to anyone.

Descent I feel (I have 1st and 2nd edition might get 3rd edition which was just teased depending on what it brings) is something different its at its best when played verses a Overlord who is semi trying to win unlike games like heroquest where they are a guide. Its competitive though not entirely so because overly competitive overlords seem to get a bad reputation so its a bit of a balancing act but as someone who loves the role its dungeon crawling at its best when you’ve got the right people.

[odinsgrandsonParticipant 4288xp 0]

– I disagree that there are no entry level Dungeon Crawlers.  The Jerry Hawthorn games- Stuffed Fables, Mice and Mystics and Aftermath are all good for this, a lot of others are just fine from an accessibility standpoint.

– As has been pointed out, we have loads of dungeon crawlers and similar games that echo HeroQuest in some way or another. Super Dungeon, Descent, Widower’s Wood, Sword and Sorcery, Shadows of Brimstone, Siege of the Citadel, Folklore, Conan, Batman, TMNT, Hellboy, Cthulhu Death May Die, Imperial Assault, Zombicide, Undercity, Gloomhaven, Comanauts, Darklight, Dark Souls, Kingdom Death, Massive Darkness, Mansions of Madness, Warhammer Quest, Altar Quest, etc.

Dungeon Crawlers and similar games are probably the genre that has jumped the most since the Age of Kickstarter began.  You’d think the genre was bloated, but I keep seeing new dungeon crawler projects pick up plenty of steam and tons of excitement over the ones that haven’t yet delivered (right now we’re waiting impatiently for Oathsworn, Etherfields, Aeon Trespass and  many others).

I suppose the question is whether HeroQuest is too generic to appeal to current gamers, but I think the name brand alone is enough to bring the game into the spotlight of success.

[limburger 21775xp 0]

@odinsgrandson they may echo Heroquest, but they aren’t as easy to explain (to kids) as Heroquest.
Dark Souls and Cthullhu require you to understand the material they were based on … and it isn’t exactly “kid friendly”

Also keep in mind that at the time Heroquest was available in regular toy shops.
Even the kid-friendly “Mice and Mystics” requires access to a good friendly local game shop as opposed to a regular mainstreet toyshop.

It might be different in other countries, but the average ‘boardgame’ in toyshops are the same cheap and nasty toys disguised as boardgames as always. It might be the cost of localization for a small market that keeps the vast majority of ‘proper’ boardgames of the shelves. Or it simply is easier to sell shiny plastic crap to toddlers & their parents.

The name brand may be enough to trigger nostalgia in those who did own it (or wanted it as kids).
It still is going to struggle when competing against the instant-fun (and multi million dollar marketing campaigns) of the videogame manufacturers.

[odinsgrandsonParticipant 4288xp 0]

– Is the hole in the market simply “A kid friendly dungeon crawler that is available at department stores and toy stores?” Because we did have HeroScape for a while there, and I don’t really know if nothing else has taken over that niche.

– I think it is kind of silly to keep bringing up the competition with video games. Over the last decade, board games have clearly shown that they can succeed in today’s market just fine.  Sure, Animal Crossing probably outsold your board game, but that’s not the bar for success (even from a retail stockist’s standpoint).

I think the more immediate concern is whether there is a place for Hero Quest in a market with lots of great dungeon crawlers.  I think the answer is “sort of.”  Certainly a lot of us will be passing on it that would have happily backed it a decade ago.

– Yeah- toy store and department store shelves tend to have the worst of games, but that’s changing a bit in the US.  Gloomhaven is available at Target (the second largest chain department store in the US).  Target has been increasing their selection of geek games by stocking anything featured on Geek and Sundry.  Wal-Mart (the bigger chain store) stocked CMON’s Marvel United game.

It certainly isn’t impossible for HeroQuest to get on the department store shelves in the US. But if they don’t, that doesn’t mean that they won’t sell enough copies to be a major success.

– I still think that Restoration is really going to have to consider what audience they are going for with this.

Do they want to make a kid friendly dungeon crawler?  Do they want to make a game that appeals to the middle aged men who played the game as kids?  Even if their intent is to have a game for nostalgia fans to play with their children, there are some changes they might want to implement.

It isn’t always wrong to change the audience- or acknowledge that your audience has changed.  The comic books for GI Joe or Avatar the Last Airbender have an older target audience than the cartoons they are based on, and this satisfied fans quite well.

[limburger 21775xp 0]

There was a lot of depth in the Last Airbender cartoons …  not all of it obvious to kids, but it definitely was there.

@odinsgrandson in the USA they don’t have the additional challenge of localization. And even despite that there has been a definite trend of ‘better’ boardgames in toyshops around here as well.

I didn’t mean to imply that a boardgame needs to be as successful as videogames.
However given the agressive advertising by videogame companies and the plug&play nature of them boardgames need to work extra hard to attract attention of teens.
Things like ‘Mice and Mystics’ could be seen as ‘not cool’ or ‘for toddlers’ …
It’s the sort of thing grandma might buy for her little nephew and while he may like it there’s no way he’s telling his friends at school he’s playing little mice …
Heroquest has a better chance … (and some of the dungeon crawlers mentioned so far would do too)

Maybe all that is needed is an App ? 😉

[ced1106Participant 6224xp 0]

> – Is the hole in the market simply “A kid friendly dungeon crawler that is available at department stores and toy stores?” Because we did have HeroScape for a while there, and I don’t really know if nothing else has taken over that niche.

That’s pretty much it. IIRC, We also had Dungeon, Dragon Quest, the D&D Electronic boardgame, and other games that barely anyone remembers. HQ was early to market, had good components, and a good game system. Dark Tower and the D&D Red Box (or blue box) were other well-remembered games, so, while they were not dungeoncrawlers, it’s not like HQ was the only dungeon-themed game we remember. Interestingly, while Restoration Games is returning HQ and DT to the hobby game market, the D&D Red Box is sold in mass market stores, and now Jaws of a Lion is in Target!

[odinsgrandsonParticipant 4288xp 0]

What is the target age for HeroQuest?  I’m hearing ‘kid friendly’ and I’m hearing ‘teens’ as well.

I know ten year olds that have picked up things like Talisman or Super Dungeon, and I played Space Crusade at about the same age (10-12 ish).

Back then, HeroQuest was meant to be a gateway game for GW to rope us into playing Warhammer (Dragon Strike was the same thing for D&D).  A new version would be a little more of an end unto itself.

[limburger 21775xp 1]

I’d say target age is “kids too young for ‘expert level’ boardgames, but too old for kiddy boardgames”
So something like 10-14 which is an age group that is always stuck between similar choices.

I remember D&D Red box. At the same time there also was “Das Schwarze Auge” (the Dark eye?), which was similar to D&D.

I don’t know if HQ needs a path towards the ‘bigger games’, but the lack of connection with the GW universe could be both a blessing and a curse. It kind of worked in its favour back then.
And one has to wonder if the target demographic needs an official setting for a game.

I’d even argue that we need games that let kids use their imagination instead of teaching them that they must follow ‘ze rules’.
The same sort of problem exists with Lego these days. Everything is geared toward building the one thing that’s on the box.

Maybe I just am bad at this sort of thing, but I do wonder if that is something that kids can be taught before school and society destroy what little imagination they’ve got left.
/rant
Sorry for that bit 😀

[odinsgrandsonParticipant 4288xp 0]

Personally, I never saw HeroQuest as a proper RPG.  Dragon Strike did that. But I know that if kids

You sound more than a bit jaded. I get the impression that this is said about every generation. I’ll grant that my experience is limited to the children I know among my family and friends, but I am really not seeing a dearth in creativity or creative options for children.

– My household seems to have very little trouble finding imagination and creation toys. Magnetiles, Play Dough, Joy Blocks, Tinker Toys and more (some old ones that are still available, some new). Legos still sells the big buckets, and the kits all get mixed together.

– The most popular video games for kids right now are all about creating and building things (currently, it looks like MineCraft and Animal Crossing are the ones every little kid plays).

– There are also a lot of kid friendly RPG systems to be had right now, so that shouldn’t be much of an issue (my family made a homebrew). I never really saw that as the role of HeroQuest (though Dragon Strike definitely did that).

– On the other points- the GW setting of the old game seemed to me like it was meant to channel HeroQuest players into Warhammer. But I think there’s an audience of HeroQuest fans who never took that step.

If the target audience is adults who played HeroQuest as kids, then it would be better to use the Old World, but I don’t know that it would be necessary.

But it is all speculation at this point, right?

[limburger 21775xp 0]

yep … it’s all speculation.
This could be an unexpected reboot of the game that just works and also attracts new people.

Everything will depend on a combination of timing and luck.
Getting the right people to do an unboxing/demo … and the thing will explode.
That’s kind of what happened to Minecraft.
A little game that no one knew until a popular YouTube channel posted a video and people discovered it.

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