All kinds of everything remind me of Blood Bowl!

[blinky465 17028xp 1]

Because OTT gets paid to promote

For me, I think this is why I’ve sort-of lost interest in OTT in recent weeks. I’ve often said, I came for the content, and stayed because of the community. And that is holding up more than ever in recent… well, months even. The video/content weekender-side of things feels very much like a series of “info-mercials” more than a show about pushing little fighting men around a tabletop.

I was really excited about Myth & Goal. I took part in the Needy Cat online seminar a few weeks back (which, if anyone is interested, was excellent) and I feel like James put together a really good game for this (he did talk about it a little, but his whole game-planning and design process is very impressive). But the whole Myth & Goal campaign was just a massive air-balloon – six months of (pretty poor) Flash-like animations, no info on rules or playthroughs until after the launch and then…. pffft. I followed the campaign closely after throwing my money in the ring. They aimed for £70k and hit about £130k then it just stalled for days and days.

Personally, I think it’s a bit of a shit move hitting more than double the quoted “target” and then pulling the plug. If £130k isn’t enough to get the game made, why bother with such a “low” target of £70k in the first place?

It just feels like Blacklist has dropped the ball here – the game itself reads really well, but the campaign was a bit half-arsed from the start. Their original selling pitch of “get some cheap proxies for Blood Bowl” really undersold the game that James and NeedyCat had devised. And their “this game deserves more” statement just reads like “we’re going to relaunch and try to get more money out of you next time” rather than “we want to add ever more stuff to make this really, really cool”.

Which brings us back to the hype around it – and in the part OTT played in that. The original video “what makes this a great Blood Bowl killer?” was spurious at best, since the video revealed almost nothing about the actual game, let alone explain why it was going to be the Blood Bowl killer it claimed it would – the entire campaign (not just the OTT video) was a series of aims and aspirations, rather than actual, played content.

And that’s where a lot of the OTT video content feels like it’s been recently (at least on the weekenders) – reviews of photos of games, reviews of up-and-coming releases, reviews of digital renders of 3d .stl files, rather than hands-on experience of actually playing these games (or printing the .stl miniatures). It’s like watching a few people on Zoom talking about websites they’ve stumbled across. Maybe there’s more to it than that and I’m doing OTT a disservice – but I only really flick through the video chapters these days, rather than sit and watch an entire 2hr video like I used to (because the content just doesn’t “grab” me like it once did). So all I see is “here’s a photo of something” and then the timeline shows 10 minutes of content; FFWD to the next section – “here’s a website talking about something else….”

Getting people in to talk about their new projects – even ones in development that don’t exist yet – is still quite interesting; but without any follow-up, it does feel like OTT (weekender at least) is becoming an outlet for “puff pieces” and adverts rather than a site where we know the personalities and connect with them. I don’t know. OTT is a very different website to the one I joined years ago. Many of us have expressed our opinions on the Zoom vs Studio format, but it feels like the very content of the videos has changed, not just the format of presenting.

As for Myth and Goal, I still think it’s a great looking game. But I’ve absolutely zero interest in supporting Blacklist Games. If a variation of it were to come out from Needy Cat (or some other publisher) I’d be inclined to look into it, as the game itself still looks really interesting. But it feels like Blacklist are just on a cash-grab by cancelling and looking to re-launch and I’ve no interest in pledging to give them my money a second time!

 

 

[rickabod41Participant 9257xp 0]

@blinky465 What a spot on post!

I stopped watching the Weekender a few months back for exactly the reasons you state.

Indie of the week – nice idea, but do we really need 20 mins of people clicking through a website?

I agree that having discussions / chats with creators is a grand idea, and surely the zoom format lends itself to that better than inviting people to a studio? Yet the last few weekenders I saw there seemed to be less and less interviews.

With regards Myth & Goal – I said this at the time that it seemed to be pitched wrong – just an excuse to sell miniatures – and the lack of any real videos / playthroughs harmed it. You are right about the way they have cancelled it as well, smacks more of wanting to generate more income than a redesign.

It’s a shame that OTT seems to have changed direction – I still like posting project updates and commenting on stuff, and have some fun interactions, but the actual core Team seem more distant now than ever.

I wonder if that’s down to the takeover?

 

[sundancer 42933xp 0]

If £130k isn’t enough to get the game made, why bother with such a “low” target of £70k in the first place?

Well I’d guess for the same reason other KS had done it: to be able to boost “Fully funded after 24h” and then show an “impressive” “500% funded” number. A number that really doesn’t say anything.

I wonder if that’s down to the takeover?

No. The change started to a degree when covid and lockdown hit. It was then when the show of a happy bunch of people in the studio (and Ben on the Telly) went to a zoom meeting. And with that I feel some… I find it hard to describe it… warmth? honest banter? “pub feeling” got lost? As we had discussed in another thread: virtual meetings are different.

I just hope that with the end of the lockdown (when ever that will be) some change in format can happen again.

[rickabod41Participant 9257xp 0]

So, you don’t think that being taken over by a company whose sole purpose is to still games, miniatures, and all related accessories, has had any bearing on OTT seemingly becoming just a series of paid for advertisements for things that Wayland Games might stock now or in the future?

I am not saying it is the only reason, but we cannot rule it out as a potential reason surely?

[sundancer 42933xp 1]

Don’t forget that OTT has a shop and online store too and had so even before the takeover. So there already was an interest to make new shiny thinks look tasty.

But then again: we can’t know for sure. The only ones that really do know are the ones on the other side of the screen.

[rickabod41Participant 9257xp 1]

very interesting discussion around the nature / purpose of the site these days.

Normal Blood Bowl related service can now be resumed!

 

[somegeezer 18431xp 1]

It’s a very interesting tangent. I wonder does it warrant it’s own thread.

I do agree the quality of reporting has dropped. I don’t agree it’s the influence of Wayland.

Stories like Myth and Goal aren’t going to benefit Wayland, it’s gamer cash going directly to a company bypassing the middleman. I guess they paid OTT for the exposure and that’s fine.

I do think that launching the KS with a fanfare and not reporting its cancellation is a failure and another mark against this site as a source of news.

Interesting times.

[rickabod41Participant 9257xp 0]

Star Player Shop

Are starting to preview a lot of nice looking Blood Bowl Models.

Some Dark Orc sculpts and some pretty hefty looking Halflings have caught my attention.

[rickabod41Participant 9257xp 0]

Pre Orders

Kreek and Wilhelm up for pre order either on the 22nd or the 29th.

[rickabod41Participant 9257xp 0]

@somegeezer and yes I definitely think this deserves its own thread!

[blinky465 17028xp 0]

I exchanged a couple of messages with James from NeedyCat and he couldn’t really say much – it was Blacklist that pulled the plug on Myth and Goal so he didn’t feel it was really his place to speak for them. But he said he is still very much involved in the game (I asked if he’d just done the game design as a contract and handed it over but it still seems to be a collaboration effort) and that the game is still going ahead.

Which I’m both pleased and disappointed about – yay, the game is going ahead, booo to giving Blacklist a pledge for my money again after they pulled a shit move the first time around. I feel pretty sour towards Blacklist – but want to try the game! A moral dilemma….

[rickabod41Participant 9257xp 1]

@blinky465 It’s a weird one, as you correctly pointed out in a previous post Myth and Goal hit its target. From the onset we were told M&G was a fully formed game, and yet it supposedly got cancelled to make changes based upon a feedback.

Not a bad thing to do – although as I made mention on another “news” article about another NeedyCat game Kickstarter, maybe look to get feedback up front rather than wait until people are pledging and then pull the plug?

It just strikes me as odd if you are so confident in your product that you would pull the whole thing based upon people’s input.

The cynic in me feels like that’s just a let’s test the waters see how much cash we can make and then withdraw it, almost like a teaser in the hope you have drummed up enough interest that when you relaunch your campaign you can make more money.

It will be very very interesting to see what changes they highlight if / when M&G relaunches.

Personally from what we were told and saw it didn’t look like a fully formed game, and it didn’t really look that original – the miniatures seemed like Greebo Games’ fantasy football range without the character, and to me anyway it always seemed like a cash grab to sell figures with a game added to it rather than the other way around.

Time will tell.

[blinky465 17028xp 1]

I always got the feeling that the game development was being pushed to the wire – just a week or two before launch and we were told “we’re just fine-tuning a few things”. The lack of play-through videos always felt a bit suspicious (the idea of holding back on how the game actually plays as a “launch surprise” always felt like a bit of an excuse) but then when the gameplay was revealed, it did seem like a pretty solid game.

I get the feeling that they were just disappointed that the funds stopped coming in – setting a target that can be smashed within two hours of launch impresses nobody except the creator! It seemed to me that they pushed hard on “get your proxies for that other fantasy football game” but the minis were actually pretty uninspiring.

I’d have been quite happy to have seen just the game released, with minis for teams added at a later date (the whole “game-only-with-standees” offering appears to have been pulled). It’s as if Blacklist didn’t have faith in the game, and just wanted to push the minis. Then made a complete hash of the campaign – offering all kinds of things, changing the offering, pulling pledge levels, adding other levels…. it really does feel like they were trying anything to just pull in ever more money, instead of focussing on getting a game to market.

I thought that the game *did* look original – the minis were pretty poor, but I like the look of the game. But I won’t be backing it a second time around. Which is a real shame. I’d happily buy into just the game (and if it was handled by not-Blacklist, I still might). The “fake-launch” teaser idea could only ever backfire – I’m not sure it was intentional, but maybe they had a particular “real target” in mind and just didn’t want to display it?

It’s quite possible that I’ll keep my money and just pick up the rules online and get some proxies for *this* particular fantasy football game from other sources, and just use their rules and a homebrew board (the irony – given this is how they positioned their offering against Blood Bowl – is not lost on me).

[rickabod41Participant 9257xp 0]

It’s quite possible that I’ll keep my money and just pick up the rules online and get some proxies for *this* particular fantasy football game from other sources, and just use their rules and a homebrew board (the irony – given this is how they positioned their offering against Blood Bowl – is not lost on me).

Ha ha, that is tremendous!

[blinky465 17028xp 1]

Oh, hello?

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